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Calypso
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Post subject: ARGH! Too... Much... Information...  Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 08:50 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2006
Posts: 14
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What size is the tank? 10g
What type of filter(s) are running on the tank? Top Fin Power Filter 10
What is the tank's temperature? Room temp, I'd assume. Don't have a thermometer.
How long has the tank been set up? Twelve hours
What are the current ammonia levels? No idea
What are the current nitrite levels? No idea
What are the current nitrate levels? No idea
What is the frequency and size of water changes? I was planning on changing thirty to fifty percent of the water every week, but I haven't started yet, obviously.
How many of what type of fish in the tank? None yet.
How long has the tank been set up? Twelve hours.
I, like so many other people, just keep a couple of fish in bad conditions, never doing my research. As I was sitting in the kitchen staring at that one little remaining neon tetra in a two gallon tank in desperate need of a water change, I decided to change that. So, we went to the pet store and got a ten gallon tank, some flourite stuff for the plants, and some black gravel to put on top. I also got two tall, dark green, leafy plants whose names I can't remember, one that has a lot of fringes on it, and one with tiny, round leaves. (Yes, yes, I should have written down their names, I know...)
Problem number one was that, though it said on the bag that the flourite had been washed previous to shipping, it was suggested that it be rinsed before putting in the tank to get rid of residual dust. So, I stuck a handful it the colander. It went right through; my colander's holes are way too big. So, stupidly, I put the gravel right into the tank and just put the black gravel on top. I started pouring in dechlorinated water very slowly, but unfortunately I hit a spot where the black gravel was spread too thin and kicked up a huge bunch of dust from the flourite. Eventually I had the tank filled with now dark brown water.
Basically, I ended up rinsing the gravel, but not doing a very good job of it. I took out and replaced the water three times (Don't worry, no fish right now, just rocks and water) in hopes of getting rid of some of the dust. Finally, I just filled up the tank and let it sit for a while. Three hours later I put in the plants. Couldn't even see them. I turned on the new filter and went to bed.
This morning, when I woke up, the water was still very hazy, but I could at least see the plants. It wasn't dark brown anymore, just too cloudy. I unplugged the filter and took out the filter cartrige thingie (looks like spongish material with carbon in it) and rinsed it out to try to get some of the dust off of it since it was absolutely filthy. Luskily, the dust came right out and I put it back in and turned the filter back on.
Surprise, surprise, a huge cloud of sust was kicked up and now I can only see vague shadows where the plants are again. It's been about twelve hours since I poured in the water and it's still so dusty. Should I just take out the plants, take out the water, and rinse out the gravel by hand or something? Or should I just let it sit? At this point the flourite and the plain black aquarium gravel have mixed, but there's more flourite than gravel, so I think it's okay for the plants, right...?
Also, I'm not sure if I'm puting enough oxygen in the water. Do I have to have an air stone or something? Or should I put in one of these disposable filters that use an air pump to put bubbles in the water or what? Or is it okay with just the power filter and the plants?
I was planning on keeping three neon tetras, three zebra danios, and one algae-eater, though I don't know what kind. Just a small fish that sucks onto the side, you know? Do you know of a specific kind I could ask for that isn't too expensive and can be found at a PetSmart?
This afternoon I was going to go buy the three zebra danois, the two new neon tetras, the algae-eater, and a couple "golden mystery snails", but I'm beginning to wonder if it's a good idea to get them so soon. How long do you think it will take for the last of this dust to stop floating around? Do you think that the filter is just going to keep kicking up dust no matter what I do? And should I just get the snails and not the fish or leave it at plant life for now?
Sorry, so many questions, but I'm very new to this and have pretty much no clue what I'm doing. All I really know to do is use dechlor water, a filter, and deep substrate for plants. Seriously, I'm at a loss. I'm still reading up on cycling, but it's all gibberish to me. |
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TammieKaye
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:14 AM |
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Forums Adviser
Joined: Jan 26, 2005
Posts: 16706
Location: Warren, OH
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I am sorry, I don't know the first thing about fluorite, but I would guess that your filter will eventually filter out the yucky stuff. Someone will be along to help you with that shortly, I am sure.
I would suggest a test kit, the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Master Freshwater test kit can be found at Petsmart. Also a thermometer and possibly a heater. The only tanks that maintain room temp for me are the small 2.5g. And depending on where you live and your heating, without a heater you could have lots of fluctuations in temps and this can be stressful to the fish.
Most people would advise you against the zebra danio, as they are crazy little fish, although hardy and a good cycle fish, they like lots of swimming room. Neon tetras are not good fish to cycle with. Do you have a filter on the 2 gal tank? Are you planning on moving that fish into the 10? |
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Tammie
Beginners 4 must reads
Beginning fishkeeping
12g, 30g, 90g Planted mixed communities,75g 2 Orandas, 100g pond, 10g Planted, Zebra Pleco, 9g betta
www.myspace.com/tammiekaye
My Photobucket
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stephen
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:19 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Dec 30, 2005
Posts: 198
Location: norwich, england, uk
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| if you like doing tank cleaning, water changes, testing water parameters, etc as much as you like typing, you should'nt have many problems.could you get a test kit and look for stickys on this site to explain cycling. try letting the tank settle for a day longer. if it clears get the danios but stay hold back on the tetras for 2 weeks at least. |
_________________
the best teacher of biology is nature,
the best study of biology is observation.
Dr. Uwe Römer
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Calypso
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:21 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2006
Posts: 14
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Two gallon has a filter and I was hoping to move that fish into the ten gallon.
I think it's a neon tetra... They're the ones that look a lot like danios but have rainbow stripes and a little less thin, right?
What fish would you recommend? And about how much do the tests, heaters, and thermometers cost? And do I need an air stone or something or will the plants provide enough oxygen?
EDIT to reply to Stephen:
So you don't think a 10gal too small for the zebras to exercise? (Sorry, I do type too much... XD; But yeah, I don't mind the cleaning.) |
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fishmama
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:25 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Mar 06, 2004
Posts: 6049
Location: Oklahoma
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You have come to the right place, and congrats on trying to make a better home for your fish. We are all glad to help.
Problem 1: Flourite. this is a very good material to use for plants, but keep in mind it is made to be similar to dirt you would plant plants in on ground, just courser. You do have a couple of options for clearing the water. A. Remove the dirt and gravel to a 5 gal bucket. Rinse in the bucket until the water overflowing the top runs clear, stirring the flourite and gravel with your hands gently meanwhile. This will remove most of the dust. Then when you replace it back in the tank, add water gently. One way of doing this is to put a saucer or small plate in the bottom of the tank for the current to hit the plate instead of the flourite. You can fill it halfway, let the water settle, and then finish filling.
Method B: Use the filter to remove the dust. This is basically what you have already started. You did exactly the right thing, only you do not have to turn the filter off to remove the floss. If you do, put the plate or saucer under the water return to prevent it getting stirred up again. Adding some quilt batting that is not flame retardant will help trap the dust faster because it is a finer material. Good news: Once it settles, the flourite should be fine. This should not be a continuous issue.
Question 2: Adding fish. I would wait until the flourite is settled and rinsed from the filter. I would start with the danios, and hold off on the neons until the tank is cycled. Many neons can be rather sensitive to water conditions and may not live through the cycling process. Wait on the algae eater until there is algae in the tank for it to eat. Then an otto is the best bet for a 10 gal. However they can also be delicate and should not be added to a cycling tank. The zebras are hardy fish, and good to start a cycle with. 2 or 3 for now would be fine. But they are very active fish and would probably want more swimming space than a 10 gal. would allow for. A good way to learn fishtank water chemistry and cycle the tank at the same time, without danger to the fish, is to go ahead and plant the tank, then leave it without fish during the cycle. To do this you will need to add a substitute source of ammonia. Best if you can find it is straight, clear, nonsudsing ammonia. If it says it has surfactant in it, this means suds. Other wise you can use high protien fish food, such as shrimp pellets. Add enough to get a reading of 5 ppm on the ammonia test and keep at this level until nitrites start showing up on the nitrite test. Then just keep the ammonia at 3 ppm. When the ammonia and nitrite reach 0 a couple hours after adding the ammonia, and you are seeing nitrates on the nitrate test, the tank is cycled. Do a large water change and add full load of fish. If you want a faster, also safe way, buy a package of biospira. This is the actual bacteria you are trying to grow in the tank, purchased in a package. Be sure to buy them from a reputable source, as if they are mishandled and/or not refridgerated they will have died off and not work. If you use biospira, add the full load of fish followed immediately by the full load of biospira. Then monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels and do water changes as needed after the first 48 hours without water changes.
Question 3: Oxygenation. Bubblers, etc. are optional. Some people like the way they look, some don't. As far as fish requirements go, the circulation from the power filter should provide enough oxygen. I would however also recommend getting a heater and thermometer. For a 10 gal. tank, a 50 watt heater should be fine. For the fish you are looking at, try to keep the water between 75 and 78 degrees. Temp changes of more than 2 degrees per day can stress fish fairly easily. A heater will keep the temp from dropping too much during the night, plus 75 to 78 is a little warmer than most people keep their rooms.
I hope this info helps you. I also recommend reading the sticky at the top of the forum labelled "4 must read articles for beginners", if you haven't already. This will give you lots of detailed info on the different ways of cycling, normal water parameters, setup of a new tank, etc. Feel free to post back if you have more questions. |
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Christy
29 gal:
2 rosy barbs, 3 peppered corys
20 gal. long:
3 rosy barbs, 1 peppered corys, 1 rubberlip
55 gal:
5 turqoise rainbows, 4 male boesemani, 2 boesemani female, 2 yoyo loaches, 2 SAE
5 gal.
1 betta
Favorite links:
http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... le&sid=343
http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... le&sid=374
http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... le&sid=305
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stephen
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:29 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Dec 30, 2005
Posts: 198
Location: norwich, england, uk
Status: Offline
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| a lot of fish shops will test your water for you if you take 100 ml in a container. heater about £6 for a 50 watt |
_________________
the best teacher of biology is nature,
the best study of biology is observation.
Dr. Uwe Römer
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Calypso
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:31 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2006
Posts: 14
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Thanks!
Trouble is, this tank is staying in the kitchen (far away from the oven, don't worry; we get great indirect sunlight in here so I thought it would be good for the plants) and we only have room for a 10gal. If the danios will want more, is there another cycling fish that is better in 10gals? (It's a shame danios like more space. I love those little guys. They're fun to watch.)
And yeah, same question as earlier: About how much do the heater and test kits and such cost?
EDIT: Yeah, I just remembered that there's an aquarium shop near yere... Well, it's a little ways away, but I could probably get to them. |
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stephen
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 10:44 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Dec 30, 2005
Posts: 198
Location: norwich, england, uk
Status: Offline
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| Calypso, i wish i was more like you, enthusiastic. i'm a bit of a depressive. keep up the good work and your'll do fine |
_________________
the best teacher of biology is nature,
the best study of biology is observation.
Dr. Uwe Römer
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fishmama
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 11:16 AM |
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FishGeek Member
Joined: Mar 06, 2004
Posts: 6049
Location: Oklahoma
Status: Offline
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Other good cycling fish for 10 gal: Cherry barbs, white cloud minnows, there are others but I can't remember them at the moment. Dwarf platys would be ok too.
Test kits: cheapest overall and most accurate are Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Master test kit. Around 30.00 in US, but will last forever and give you about 500 tests.
Heaters: 50 watt should be plenty, they range in price from 8 or 10.00 to 25 or so. Beware, the old adage of you get what you pay for definitely applies to heaters.
Moving the filter from the 2 gal. would definitely help with the cycling. I don't know about putting the neon in a cycling tank though. On one hand, the filter is already cycled for his amount of waste, so it would be fine if it was just him. When you start adding more fish, you could add just 1 or 2 at a time and watch the water params very close, and you might be ok. But with a neon, you would have to keep the ammonia and nitrites as low as possible, less than .25 ammonia and less .5 nitrite. |
_________________
Christy
29 gal:
2 rosy barbs, 3 peppered corys
20 gal. long:
3 rosy barbs, 1 peppered corys, 1 rubberlip
55 gal:
5 turqoise rainbows, 4 male boesemani, 2 boesemani female, 2 yoyo loaches, 2 SAE
5 gal.
1 betta
Favorite links:
http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... le&sid=343
http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... le&sid=374
http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... le&sid=305
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TammieKaye
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| Post subject: RE: ARGH! Too... Much... Information... Posted: Mar 19, 2006 - 11:48 AM |
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Forums Adviser
Joined: Jan 26, 2005
Posts: 16706
Location: Warren, OH
Status: Offline
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Exactly what I was going to suggest, as Christy said, if you can move the filter from the little tank and run it along with your new one, that little guy will be covered (the bacteria in your little filter is built up for the one fish you have). But, when you start adding more fish, the bacteria has to "catch up", so very few at a time. Neons are read and blue "neon" like color?
I would go get your other things that you need and take pen and paper with you, write down the fish that you really like, and come back and post here to see if they would be good to cycle, and ok for a 10g tank  |
_________________
Tammie
Beginners 4 must reads
Beginning fishkeeping
12g, 30g, 90g Planted mixed communities,75g 2 Orandas, 100g pond, 10g Planted, Zebra Pleco, 9g betta
www.myspace.com/tammiekaye
My Photobucket
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